Two Way Hard Three | Las Vegas Casino & Design Blog

February 15, 2009

RJ: iPhone Used for Card Counting?

Posted by Hunter

An interesting note in the 'Inside Gaming' column today - it seems that the Nevada Gaming Control Board is looking into reports that software for the iPhone and iPod Touch could potentially be used to cheat in casinos at games like Blackjack. Counting is not illegal in Nevada but using an electronic device to aid is.

There are many 21 training programs available on the iTunes Store, some that do include a 'counting feature'.

http://www.lvrj.com/business/39633187.html

There's even some vague implication that the phones could be banned - which would be useless... All the various smartphones allow downloadable applications, not just the iPhone - that's nothing new. As they become more and more popular, customers will not stand for not being able to use their phones in casinos.

Game protection is important but these guys need to figure out how to do it without pissing the customer off.

Oh, and IG: iTunes is not a Web site, BTW.

BTW, if you're looking for something fun to do with your iPhone or iPod Touch, consider Vegas Mate (card counting not included)!


Categories: Business of Gaming
Tags: lasvegas, vegas, vegasmate


Comments

Read archived comments (14 so far)
February 16, 2009 2:03 AM Posted by motoman

One dealer at Encore did tell me the iPhone had to stay in my pocket, because of counting programs that exist. That was the first I'd heard of it, and that was at the end of January. (The same dealer--an iPhone owner himself--said the iPhone was very popular with his colleagues, and I was stunned how high a ratio of all phones in Wynn & Encore were iPhones.)

Then again, one pit boss forbade the use of those wallet-sized odds charts at the table, too. (Another, however, was very interested in seeing how Shazam worked: Very well. I had great success playing "name that tune" inside Wynn & Encore, even with the often obscure tracks and remixes that compose their soundtrack.)

This "Inside Gaming" story has shades of anti-Apple F.U.D., however: "The program....operates in the 'stealth mode,' in which the phone's screen is shut off. The program can be run effortlessly without detection as long as the user knows where the keys are." Well, that alone would be some trick, accurately tapping invisible keys on a dark screen without attracting attention. (The iPhone has no physical keys, unlike plenty of other smartphones that could be operated by feel inside a pocket.)

February 16, 2009 6:49 AM Posted by doc_al

I thought casino's already backed off anybody using a phone at the table? And frankly, I hope they never stop doing that. Left to their own devices (pun intended) the average person has trouble with when it is/isn't appropriate to use a cell phone.

February 16, 2009 7:03 AM Posted by Jeff in OKC

I can't figure out how a person could use the device without being noticed. Anyone know how this would work?

February 16, 2009 8:52 AM Posted by brent

I remember reading an article somewhere that basically said the allure of card counting just benefits the casinos with higher play at the tables, because the reality is there's probably only a dozen people in the world that have mastered it to the point where they can consistently win. I doubt the average joe is going to be able to use this app, concentrate on the game and look natural simutaneously. They will just make more money off stupid frat boys failing to play perfect blackjack while distracted with their iphones.

February 16, 2009 9:21 AM Posted by Hunter

Oh, I don't think people should be able to talk on the phone *at* the tables - I agree, that would be supremely annoying.

What would be ridiculous would be something akin to the sportsbook ban that was lifted. I'm not saying I think that is likely but as Moto said, the article sounded a little like FUD to me.

February 16, 2009 9:22 AM Posted by Hunter

BTW, I believe this is the app they are talking about:

http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewSoftware?id=294151538&mt=8

(opens in iTunes)

February 16, 2009 5:19 PM Posted by Jason Robar

I was with a friend at the Trop on the Saturday of Super Bowl weekend, and my friend was asked to stop texting at the table. Trop's policy is that you can talk on the phone while at the table, but if you're texting, you have to leave the table.

February 16, 2009 5:29 PM Posted by Jason Robar

I was with a friend at the Trop on the Saturday of Super Bowl weekend, and my friend was asked to stop texting at the table. Trop's policy is that you can talk on the phone while at the table, but if you're texting, you have to leave the table.

February 17, 2009 1:37 AM Posted by motoman

Jason, that's a weird one....
I did note that every cellphone user (that I saw) at Encore had the good sense and courtesy to leave the table to talk. I merely got mine out in order to Shazam the occasional tune I wanted to identify from Wynn's soundtrack. Funny, that one pit boss actually came around the table to see it.

Could be a different story (and crowd) depending on where you are. I still remember a woman downtown, chastising me for splitting 8's. Yeah....

February 17, 2009 9:44 AM Posted by Tom M.

OK not being an apple insider, I have no idea what FUD means.

February 17, 2009 9:45 AM Posted by Hunter

FUD is not an Apple specific term.

It means 'fear, uncertainty and doubt'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fear,_uncertainty_and_doubt

February 17, 2009 12:08 PM Posted by mike_ch

Motoman: "I was stunned how high a ratio of all phones in Wynn & Encore were iPhones"

I wouldn't be. I saw quite a few at the Encore opening, but on employees the only reason I'd be surprised is because Wynn Esplenade has a Vertu store so I figured Wynn Resorts would have some sort of discount with Nokia.

iPhones are certainly not exclusive or status items anymore. I rode a bus from San Francisco to my home up in wine country and all but one or two people had iPhones. Two teenage girls were swapping each others phones to gawk at pictures while some guy with the "hoodie wearing thug" look was thumbing through his contacts.

February 21, 2009 12:52 PM Posted by HearditinVegas.com Admin

I think that using a device to cheat the system is not ethical and should not be tolerated. That does not change the fact that having a phone that can do that is awesome!

March 11, 2009 9:47 PM Posted by cochise

I have this App. And i can see where it could be used discreetly in a casino. it would take some practice. but could be done. The problem would be that you would have to keep your hand in your pocket the whole time. which would look awkward. and be a big red flag to security about what you are doing. I would never try to use it at a Blackjack table . Because that would be a felony. we're talking Major jail time.